Why animosity towards certain makes?

"Michael Maguire" (michaelmag25) 01/19/2015 at 22:16 • Filed to: Why?, Car Culture

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Today, I hungout with a friend of mine who has a 2002 zo6 Vette. I loved his car and it is surprisingly fast. We were talking and he mentioned how he will only own LS motors and buy GM.

I love LS motors as much as the next enthusiast, but why should you hate on other cars? We are all brought together by our love of cars and no one should care if you drive a Lamborghini or a Honda.

Everyone has their own opinions and preferences, but they should not be prejudiced against one make or another for any reason...

What say you oppo?

Random cool Eldorado I saw this past weekend for your time...

For Sweden > Michael Maguire 01/19/2015 at 22:17

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Because I will never recognize the Czech Republic

sm70- why not Duesenberg? > Michael Maguire 01/19/2015 at 22:18

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I am as against this strict brand loyalty as you can be.

Jedidiah > Michael Maguire 01/19/2015 at 22:18

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Bad experiences maybe.

I'm not particularly fond of Buick, every single Buick we've owned has sucked while every Cadillac or Oldsmobile has been great.

ranwhenparked > Michael Maguire 01/19/2015 at 22:18

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Because some people are narrow minded, poorly informed, and prejudiced. Not necessarily all three at once, but there you go. I'd say its most common amoung Toyota and Honda car owners and Big Three pickup truck owners, but it can happen to anybody.

Brian Silvestro > Michael Maguire 01/19/2015 at 22:18

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I really dislike people that either hate or love every car a brand has ever made because they love/hate the brand to death.

TheHondaBro > Michael Maguire 01/19/2015 at 22:19

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I know someone who's a huge Ford elitist. No matter what I'd say, he'd pounce with "true blue Ford fan" shit.

Sure enough, he tried to defend his (old) shitty Focus when I said I liked the new BMW M5.

If you show extreme favor towards one brand, who the hell do you think you're impressing anyway? Why are you doing it? You're not doing anyone any favors.

Michael Maguire > TheHondaBro 01/19/2015 at 22:20

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exactly, he started talking smack against the 5.0 from Ford and I said, "you know it can outrun you, right"? This led to an argument

That Bastard Kurtis - An Attempt to Standardize My Username Across Platforms > Michael Maguire 01/19/2015 at 22:21

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I agree and I dont. I would never dislike somebody personally because of their taste in cars, but like everything in life, there are things you like and don't like. I don't like all cars...I don't like low riders, dubs, Miatas, or bro trucks. I suppose I can respect one that a lot of work went in to, but you don't need to like it just because of that, you know?

Again, if somebody is a car guy that's good enough for me. But I don't need to like their cars, and they shouldn't need my approval.

HammerheadFistpunch > Michael Maguire 01/19/2015 at 22:22

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I like to pretend im not brand loyal, but we all are to a degree.

Michael Maguire > sm70- why not Duesenberg? 01/19/2015 at 22:22

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why can't people just respect the cars for what they are and move on? I don't care if it isn't your cup of tea! Don't buy it and keep your mouth shut...

AthomSfere > Michael Maguire 01/19/2015 at 22:22

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An exception: Mustangs!

OK, there have been a few good ones, the 1st gen and the latest 2015 are really, really awesome! But the rest were really meh. Sure good enough for their generation but meh, and the Stang-bros just go and ruin what respect I have for those less-cool year Mustangs.

Michael Maguire > That Bastard Kurtis - An Attempt to Standardize My Username Across Platforms 01/19/2015 at 22:23

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I agree that everyone has different tastes and that is kind of what makes car culture so awesome!

It doesn't mean you should hate on someone else for their differences...that is just grade school bully S***

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > Michael Maguire 01/19/2015 at 22:24

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Has he ever driven in anything else? I've ridden in LS powered cars(that came with them), and while I see the appeal to the engine, holy shit is everything else is bad.

AthomSfere > ranwhenparked 01/19/2015 at 22:24

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As a many Honda owner... I have seen a pretty fair split between them. A ton of ricer crazed tuners and a ton of people who just don't car as long as it meets their goals.

As for big 3... Mustang owners. I really am considering a 2015 Mustang but I am terrified of being a Mustang owner :(

Michael Maguire > HammerheadFistpunch 01/19/2015 at 22:24

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but I'm sure you don't hate on people for making their own choices in cars because of it.

Favorites are fine, but who cares what someone else drives.

Biased Plies > Michael Maguire 01/19/2015 at 22:26

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There are only two kinds of people I hate: those who are intolerant of other's people's automotive preferences, and Vdubs.

Michael Maguire > AthomSfere 01/19/2015 at 22:26

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You are speaking to someone who owns a 2014 mustang...

I hate the stereotypes that come with certain cars...

Mustang - redneck bro

Honda - ricer doucher

Prius - entitled environmentalist prick

Song time... "WHY CANT WE BE FRIEND!?"

That Bastard Kurtis - An Attempt to Standardize My Username Across Platforms > Michael Maguire 01/19/2015 at 22:27

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Agreed. I'm not interested in shouting "your car sucks!" at people. I'm 30. I'd never just tell somebody I hate their car even if I do, if they asked I'd say it's not my style. There are books and movies I don't like, there are cars I don't like.

End of the day, there are only two things in this world I can not stand: people who are intolerant of other people's car cultures, and stanced cars.

Michael Maguire > Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies 01/19/2015 at 22:27

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he had a 2011 g8, a 2012 v6 Stang, and now a 2002 zo6.

Preferences are great, but don't hate on others for their choices

Michael Maguire > Biased Plies 01/19/2015 at 22:28

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This made me laugh :)

HammerheadFistpunch > Michael Maguire 01/19/2015 at 22:28

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yeah, thats true. if someone asks my opinion I usually give it to them in a watered down "not an ass about it" kind of way but I would rarely try and make someone feel bad about it. I developed an attitude several years ago that is basically "every car has at least one thing going for it" and that usually helps temper my feelings on cars generally.

Michael Maguire > That Bastard Kurtis - An Attempt to Standardize My Username Across Platforms 01/19/2015 at 22:28

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can I get an AMEN? Haha

Michael Maguire > HammerheadFistpunch 01/19/2015 at 22:29

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that's a great attitude to have.

AthomSfere > Michael Maguire 01/19/2015 at 22:30

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D'oh, you bit the bullet one year too soon!

You can get a free pass though assuming:

You bought the car -

Not because you wanted a Muscle Car and Mustang was your only option

Because you at least test drove the (IMO better) options (V8 Camaro, Challenger/ V6 Genesis, Camaro, Challenger)

You don't run around with a rebel flag proclaiming the Mustang as the best thing since the Model A

StingrayJake > Michael Maguire 01/19/2015 at 22:41

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My grandfather spent most of his life working in Chevrolet dealerships so I was brainwashed early. That being said, I'm pretty mature about it and can appreciate many makes.

Of course my wife has a big problem with American cars (she was stunned when I told her our new Altima was built in Tennessee). Her family has always had Hondas, she's had a Jetta, loves BMW, and hates Toyota (she claims they have horrible recall rate).

A co-worker of mine takes every chance he gets to rip American cars. He mentioned the other day that all of them have been shit since "George Bush bought GM." He's a huge GT-R fan... like couldn't shut up about it when the local school had one on campus for a trade class. He couldn't believe anybody would let a teenager even breathe on a GT-R.

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > Michael Maguire 01/19/2015 at 22:41

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I don't hate anybody for their choices. I may hate their choice, but not them. Now if you're 16 bragging about your new car your parents bought for you and how it's better than someone's older car that they paid for, I will hate you for that.

Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo > Michael Maguire 01/19/2015 at 22:42

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A 19 year old with a 90s Accord with the, ah, preferred-by-latino-community? modified taillights teased me for driving my Tercel, calling it slower than something I don't recall. Even better because he had the automatic. *sigh*

deekster_caddy > Michael Maguire 01/19/2015 at 22:46

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Most everyone has a stigma for what they know. My first car was an MGB, second was a Buick. I learned how to wrench on MGs and Buicks, so I gravitate towards GM cars. I don't like working on late model chryslers because all the plastic breaks. Fords are who we scoffed at on race day...

But these days I appreciate all makes and models if someone is putting some kind of effort into learning about their car or modifying or anything to help keep the entusiasts and aftermarket growing.

BJ > Michael Maguire 01/19/2015 at 22:47

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Could it be some sort of base instinct, a tribal thing, where we identify with a group/company/brand/idea, and then vigorously defend it because the other groups, to which we do not belong, must certainly be inferior?

Michael Maguire > AthomSfere 01/19/2015 at 22:48

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Free Pass Enabled.

Bought it at 19 by myself after working since 12.

Looked at both alternates and couldn't see out of them and felt cramped. I'm 6 foot, 200 lbs.

I respect the camaros and challengers and will wave to them on the road.

Did not look at v8 because I did not have enough money to be in v8 range. I also don't think it would be good to have over 400 horsepower at 19 now 20. I get into enough trouble as it is.

My only mistake which I hope to resolve in the next year would be getting an automatic because I couldn't drive stick. I just was a teenager wanting a sports car and my wisdom and maturity has grown a little in 2 years.

Lastly, I know the mustang is not god's gift to mankind and there are hundreds if not thousands of better cars out there that I someday hope to drive and own!

I hope this covers everything and you don't think less of me or others who bought a mustang based on stereotypical findings with the crowd.

ranwhenparked > HammerheadFistpunch 01/19/2015 at 22:49

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Consumers tend to have a group of preferred brands for any given product category that they shop among and rarely venture out of that group, but aren't loyal to one and only specific brand. That changes a bit the more expensive and consequential the purchase, but it still holds almost as true with cars as it does with toothpaste. It's just part of the way the mind naturally works to process, store, and categorize information and ease decision making.

Michael Maguire > StingrayJake 01/19/2015 at 22:50

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the George bush comment made me chuckle. I guess all you can do is laugh at people and their assumptions. Life is too short to hate someone for their choice in transportation!

Michael Maguire > Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies 01/19/2015 at 22:51

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agreed! You have no idea how many people I had to tell. No no mommy and daddy didn't do shit. The car was me and me alone

sm70- why not Duesenberg? > HammerheadFistpunch 01/19/2015 at 22:51

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We all are, but the degree varies a ton. I like German cars, especially Audis, but I could never be one of those "I've only ever owned German cars, I will only ever own German cars, all other cars suck because I once drove a Kia Rio" people. People who refuse to drive anything other than a *insert qualifier here* car baffle me.

PatBateman > Michael Maguire 01/19/2015 at 22:51

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I have no problem whatsoever with cars of any type, nor the owners who buy them.

Except for the Prius and their owners.

F*ck those guys. HARD.

Michael Maguire > Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo 01/19/2015 at 22:52

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as I said in another post, "life is too short to give crap to someone for their choice in transportation..."

Michael Maguire > deekster_caddy 01/19/2015 at 22:53

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completely agree. Anything to better the car culture for future generations is good with me!

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > Michael Maguire 01/19/2015 at 22:54

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I won't deny that my parents bought my 20 year old Toyota with 160k miles, but it's nothing special. The only bragging right I have is to my other friends who drive vehicles their parents bought for them, when they break.

Michael Maguire > BJ 01/19/2015 at 22:55

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it very well could be but I'd like to think as humans we should evolve from that thinking and work towards a better community for all...damn I feel like a politician or something

Michael Maguire > Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies 01/19/2015 at 22:56

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I have no problem with parents buying cars for their kids. Unless they are brand new Lexuses or lexii? And then the kid brags like he is king of the world! That bothers me deep.

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > Michael Maguire 01/19/2015 at 23:00

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Yeah, even if I were rich, I wouldn't buy my non-existing kid a nice car. I'd buy them something liveable, but not good. Something worse than what I got.

El Rivinado > Michael Maguire 01/19/2015 at 23:07

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Personally it could be the culture in which they were raised/what they were brought up on. My Dad buys American as do my uncle, and my grandparents both buy American. Specifically from GM, my grandparents have brought from GM all their lives and would not consider anything else, my Grandpa has a GMC Yukon as his current car along with a GM Pickup, and my uncle owns a Chevy Cruze. But there's a reason, my Grandpa worked at GM for a good forty years, from the time he got out of the army, to about 2004, he kept his job at GM and would not consider anything else. Now it could be different but income level could play a role, the GM job meant my dad and uncle weren't exactly spoiled, they're family had to keep money a bit tight considering the wages, but considering that was one of the few career opportunities my granddad had when he got back home, you worked with what you had. Plus considering they were raised in Ohio, one of the largest American car cultured states in America, its not hard to be biased to whichever company you're working for if it meant putting food on the table. I know that's specific, but its not hard to see the differences in brand loyalty between the hardworking man who finally saved enough to buy a Cadillac, and the snobby 16 year old silver spooner who got a new BMW for their birthday.

deekster_caddy > That Bastard Kurtis - An Attempt to Standardize My Username Across Platforms 01/19/2015 at 23:09

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Hah. Stance is still the one thing I just don't get.

qbeezy > Michael Maguire 01/19/2015 at 23:10

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I have no idea why people show such intense loyalty to a freaking company that you pay thousands of dollars to. They DON'T DO ANYTHING FOR YOU. It's like the same thing for colleges and sports teams. You're so loyal to them, but they show ZERO loyalty to you unless you got the CASH.

deekster_caddy > StingrayJake 01/19/2015 at 23:12

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At least he's not screaming "it's Obummer's fault" like so many do!

(Not how I feel, I feel bad for anybody in that seat, there is absolutely no way to have a 'successful' presidency today. Every decision you make is wrong)

Michael Maguire > Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies 01/19/2015 at 23:13

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Exactly. I learned to drive on a 2003 Ford Ranger. It had peeling paint, over 100K miles, and was the slow one. I didn't care what I was driving as long as I had wheels. This is a blessing in itself.

Michael Maguire > El Rivinado 01/19/2015 at 23:15

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Very well said sir. Brand Loyalty is a good thing in my opinion, but brand Snobbery is outrageously annoying if that makes any sense. To your family, I have no problem with only wanting to buy GM, especially taking into account that the income was coming directly from the company. My issues are with the entitled little punks who think their S*** don't stink...

Michael Maguire > qbeezy 01/19/2015 at 23:17

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Another Opponaut posted about how his Grandfather had worked at GM for over 40 years putting food on the table for his family. This I can completely understand. What I don't understand is your everyday punk who believes that they are a gift from God and their automotive choices are perfection.

deekster_caddy > Jedidiah 01/19/2015 at 23:18

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I've had the opposite experience with Buick, mine have all been very long lasting and extremely reliable with some commonly known issues easily repaired. I still have the '73 LeSabre my grandparents bought new, and I abused the hell out of that thing for over a decade before I started trying to save it.

qbeezy > Michael Maguire 01/19/2015 at 23:20

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Working for GM? Yeah that's pretty awesome. Bragging on your fox body mustang cause you picked it up on CL only because you missed the best miata ever from NJ? Giant douche. Man that example was oddly specific...

Jedidiah > deekster_caddy 01/19/2015 at 23:23

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I honestly think I'm very unlucky. They had to have been lemons.

On a side note, I prefer the Olds and Caddy big blocks to the Buicks and Pontiacs, but I'd totally rock a massive Buick with a Nailhead or Fireball straight 8.

I can still respect Buick's engineering and style despite their fiercely old-school approach to things and the lemons my family has had.

Alfalfa > Michael Maguire 01/19/2015 at 23:33

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Because people are meanie-faces.

deekster_caddy > Jedidiah 01/19/2015 at 23:38

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I love the way Buick's 455 runs with that low end grunt. The 500 was the same way, I had the big caddy block in my '73 Buick for a few years, then put it in my '86 Suburban. A mild cam and that thing could haul some loads!

We are in the middle of finishing up moving the EFI 455 my brother built into my LeSabre. It pulls like nothing I've ever experienced. Even my '05 Yukon XL with the 496 (Vortec 8100 motor) was a slug in comparison to the '76 500" block... that 496 has some power, but GM left it with serious breathing problems.

Jedidiah > deekster_caddy 01/19/2015 at 23:44

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The big caddys are huge, but apparently don't weight very much.

A 500 with aluminum manifold is only 50 lbs more than a chevy 350 according the internet.

I wish Cadillac had made a B-body car with the 500 in the 60s and 70s, it would have been a blast.

I hear they are a fairly popular swap for gm offroaders too.

StingrayJake > deekster_caddy 01/19/2015 at 23:54

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That's truly a position where 30 percent hate you, 30 percent love you, and 40 percent don't give a shit.

Denver Is Stuck In The 90s > Michael Maguire 01/20/2015 at 00:21

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According to my mom, no german cars because hitler.

deekster_caddy > Jedidiah 01/20/2015 at 06:27

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The BBB is actually lighter than the chevy 350 (it's all hollow steel after all). The primary drawback is lack of a 4-bolt main, therefore a tendency to drop the crank at very high hp levels. That's why our had a girdle installed, it's basically a big steel net that bolts into the oil pan bolts and reinforces the main caps (machining required to install).

Visible in this pic just above the oil pan:

thebigbossyboss > Michael Maguire 01/20/2015 at 07:24

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Because. There are cars I don't like, and cars I like. I will never buy the crap I don't like, and will tease people who do. I think working in electoral politics as I do, you get a good perspective on this in your day to day. I have friends (I swear!) and we disagree on many political things, as we say in the biz, it's not personal it's politics.

With cars it's the same. There are people on here who believe my car is absolute garbage. That's their opinion. I think some people's cars on here are garbage, and tease them about it, but it's not personal and I don't take it personal it cars.

Arguments are only personal if you make them personal.

thebigbossyboss > That Bastard Kurtis - An Attempt to Standardize My Username Across Platforms 01/20/2015 at 07:27

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Do you differentiate between stance and lowrider?

thebigbossyboss > Michael Maguire 01/20/2015 at 07:28

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I care far more about "how" someone else drives, then what they drive.

thebigbossyboss > HammerheadFistpunch 01/20/2015 at 07:28

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...what does the prius have going for it? Just curious?

thebigbossyboss > Michael Maguire 01/20/2015 at 07:29

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That Bastard Kurtis - An Attempt to Standardize My Username Across Platforms > thebigbossyboss 01/20/2015 at 07:35

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I do, actually. When I say low rider, I mean a classic low rider...big Cadillacs, Lincolns, Caprices. All slammed to the ground over shiny wheels, small or large, maybe sometimes with hydraulics.

Stanced cars are usually sport compacts dropped down over big wheels with stretched tires and massive amounts of negative camber, possible air suspension.

I suppose technically stance cars are a variety of low riders? Like all stance cars are low riders, but not all low riders are stance cars.

thebigbossyboss > That Bastard Kurtis - An Attempt to Standardize My Username Across Platforms 01/20/2015 at 07:40

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Just curious. I do too, I love the look of lowered cars, even though when my mine was lowered, (and then lowered again by having its suspension collapse) I had to go 2mph over every bump hahaha. I like low riders, but unless very slight, the negative camber is goofy.

I don't hate it, I just don't want to drive it or pay for new tires every week.

Smallbear wants a modern Syclone, local Maple Leafs spammer > Michael Maguire 01/20/2015 at 07:42

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Because while I can accept that other people make very good cars, I have always been brand loyal and have been too vocal to change. E.g. Ford Raptor, Fusion I like very much. Would not buy. Although I would buy European vehicles, for some reason I never developed any aversion to them. Probably due to having VW's in the drive.

That Bastard Kurtis - An Attempt to Standardize My Username Across Platforms > thebigbossyboss 01/20/2015 at 07:48

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Oh yeah, I like a lowered car too. I mean look at my Corvair, it's been dropped about 2", looks great.

My main gripe with stance cars isn't even the height or the camber, it's the stretched tires. I saw one a few weeks ago stretched so that the wheel lip was almost on the ground, sticking straight up past the tire. It was absurd.

Smallbear wants a modern Syclone, local Maple Leafs spammer > thebigbossyboss 01/20/2015 at 07:51

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Nothing that I can see other than smug. They aren't fast, aren't good looking, don't handle well, and aren't even that "green" or economical.

thebigbossyboss > That Bastard Kurtis - An Attempt to Standardize My Username Across Platforms 01/20/2015 at 07:52

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Yeah, stretching tires is one of the worst automotive trends of late for sure. It's certainly amongst the most dangerous. Sure whistle tips and truck nutz are dumb, but at least they're not dangerous.

BJ > Michael Maguire 01/20/2015 at 08:28

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Humans have evolved to better serve their base instincts, selfish ones included. You think we learned to make fire and generate electricity and build cars so that we could be comfortable? No, we did it so that we can dedicate more effort and energy to further our base desires, our animal needs: hunger, sex, and power.

HammerheadFistpunch > thebigbossyboss 01/20/2015 at 09:51

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isn't it obvious?

thebigbossyboss > HammerheadFistpunch 01/20/2015 at 09:56

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It lets you self identify people you don't want to associate with?

Or perhaps a benefit is that it can be made to be the butt of all jokes.

Jedidiah > deekster_caddy 01/21/2015 at 01:49

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Oldsmobiles lack 4 bolt mains as well, but they have thick cylinder walls unlike the buick.

Oldsmobiles have little problems with their cranks, but most people put girdles on them as well if they are turning huge rpms. Most Olds girdles just cover the main caps and only require the tops of the main caps to be machined. I've only seen one drop at the rear main, but he was throwing a lot of nitrous at it.

Olds con rods are forged steel and the cranks are nodular iron or forged steel depending on the year. The later smog choked motors were grey iron unfortunately.

They both have their own unique oiling problems as far as I know: the Olds floods the top end without restrictive pushrods and the Buick starve bearings like an AMC as far as I know.

deekster_caddy > Jedidiah 01/21/2015 at 06:21

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This particular motor has had oil passages opened up, custom rods and pistons as well. Pistons are a nitrous design with a thick head and low rings. Lots of tweaks and modifications in here so it can hand the power and last a very long time. So far it's done that well!

Jedidiah > deekster_caddy 01/21/2015 at 13:06

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Nice. Did you ever have problems with the front timing cover and oil pump assembly on a Buick?

We've had a couple of Buicks and they always leaked like a sieve from the timing cover.

My AMC 360 has the same problem, in fact it reminds of a Buick in lots of respects. It is a thin wall block, funky oiling issues, and has a very similar oil pump/timing/distributor assembly up front. This is interesting because this gen of amc motors was introduced after they used the Buick 350 in Jeeps for a number of years. Makes me think that AMC ripped off Buick's design.

deekster_caddy > Jedidiah 01/21/2015 at 13:09

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Never had issues with timing cover leaks, but we did replace the rope seal with a rubber seal.

They are also known for oil pump wear on the timing cover if it's not shimmed properly (the oil pump gears get the shims). Replacement timing covers in good condition are hard to find, and the one company that makes new ones charges about $500 a pop.

Jedidiah > deekster_caddy 01/21/2015 at 13:16

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I've had more experience with AMCs, but their timing covers are exactly the same way.

I'd love to have an old Kaiser Jeep with a Buick 350, the swap potential would be enormous.